OK. So Sebak, Blundite and I had just finished up a North Ro LDON and had a good group 2 mages, and and enchanter rounding out the pally, beastlord, and cleric. We mowed though the first dungeon on normal and were set to kick it up to hard. Well, chanter "had" to leave, see I am 60, and Sebak and Blundite are both 61. The others where 65, 64, and 63. So, we are looking for another to fill group. Bludite gets a 65 ranger, she enters group asks class and level, sees lvl and says sorry your too low... and disbands. OK, he gets another person, a 65 Shadowknight. After we get going he realizes the adventure is not hard and figures he will get only 34 AP. I ask how long he had been LFG, 2 hours. I was on for 2 hours, did 2 LDoNs, got 4 and a half blue xp, and over 50 AP, and was LFG for about 10 mins..... Here is what I dont get, how can anyone with a 5th grade education not see that doing something, even for less points each time, is better than doing nothing and getting nothing? I asked how many days played he had on his 65 SK over 135 days, Heir is my slow leveler and he has 62 days for 60 (almost 61) levels...59 bard has 31 days. Point is I guess that I have no problem doing an LDoN with lower level folks. One, they get good xp, making them less low level as time goes by, and two I get something. As a tank I would rather be the highest or close to it than the lowest. I just donot see the fun in being picky about who you group with as far as level goes, to me just means you get done sooner, turn around and do another.
I have to agree with you on this one. We had a similar situation. We usually always group with guildies or with guilds we know. We had four guildies and one non guildy who was a friend of ours. 65 Pally, 63 Wiz, 62 Ranger, and 60 Beastlord, and 63 Cleric. We start looking for a enchanter or shaman to round out the group... well.. we go through at least 10 people LFG's mind you and they all had different reasons.. ranging from too low a group... asking who would be tanking and didn't like that a pally was tanking, said we didn't have enough DPS, said they wanted to finish the adventure quick so we would have to bring two or three mobs at a time, one guy even said he could do the adventure for 20 minutes and then had to leave.. LOL, oh.. my alltime favorite.. I'll be afk for most of the adventure but you guys should be ok..
Not sure what peoples thinking is nowadays.... I just like grouping with people and enjoying the conversation and fun of it all..
Good luck out there.. LOL.. but remember.. if you need a group.. just send one of us a tell.. we'll group with ya..
There are too many people out there that only want max exp or max adventure pt groups. You will find that around 60 is the hardest point to find pick-up LDON groups because the 65 groups dont want you. Outside BB its hard to find a pick-up group anyway. I'm tired of classes who think they are elite, like chanters and clerics asking if the group is full and ready to go when I send a tell. The other day we had a cleric basically hold the group hostage by leaving when the group voted to go to a different dungeon then they wanted and we had to change dungeons, then the cleric convienientlty LDed after a wipe (we had won but were trying to rush to a named).
Like all easy exp zones (KC, BoT, etc) LDoNs attract the worst players. You don't need a lot of skill to survive a LDoN and if you do die, theres no respawns behind you. The plus is you don't have to worry about being trained by these bad players.
LOL, well I will not go into some of the horror stories, actually, I have very few in regards to LDoNs. The failures have been mixed, some group makeup, some folks liking to trigger the dead bodies wating mana, some bad pulls, some just plain old bad luck. I have found that since I started being group leader/former things are a bit different. I do understand why folks would prefer to have levels higher for the xp, loot, and AP to be beter. I do not mind when folks make fun as me as the "MA", I do not have the best offensive output and will be the first to tell you. I am good at my job. If I am MA no one else is going to get hit except on a bad pull. If I am backup healer, you will be healed until I am OOM and LoH is gone. If I am pulling I will do my best to pull singles, or doubles max.... and I do very well. Now, if you just happen to prefer to sit around with the LFG flag on and I send you a tell, I am in the process of forming a group. I always HAVE to have a cleric. Why? Cause the shaman wants a cleric and I want a shaman. I will go with out a chanter before I go without a shaman... If your a Beastlord or a rogue or a ranger or when high enough a beserker your in too, I like DPS groups over mana dependent. I prefer to have KEI on so I can pacify, chain stun, mana drain, and heal. I load 660 hp group heal, 220 group heal, 700 HoT, and Superior healing. I load lvl 61 root for root parking. If I had my way every group would be
Pally(me), Cleric, Shaman, Beastlord, Beastlord, (rogue, ranger, monk).
I must be doing something right, just dinged 61.... 
the right group lol in my personal opinion is
tank class, slower, cleric 2 dd classes and fill in whatever u want.
with this combo i have had much sucess i dont put classes in except for cleric. not saying i havent won with other healers but cleric is best.
Yanen
Best classes I've found is simply those that know how to work together.
Once did a LDoN with 4 lv 65 beastlords, 1 lv 65 druid, and 1 65 pally... WT healed when we needed it, but it was almost never needed -- our DPS was INSANE! Fastest win I've ever had...
A lot of times though, when I'm working on forming a group, here's what I look for....
<There is me (65 pally) and Willowtear (65 druid - my wife in RL so there won't be one without the other)...>
What I look for is...
1 -- a slower.
IF it's a chanter, then all the essential classes are filled and I'll go with ANYONE who wants to fill the other spots. They can mezz adds. 
IF it's a shaman, then I'll look for another tank to "split tank" in the cases where 2 or more come at once.. After that, ANYONE can be in the last few spots.
If we get a cleric, WT can nuke for DPS instead of heal.. If not, then she's a more than capable healer...
Some of the successful groups I've had is:
Pally, Druid, Shammy, Ranger, Mage, Necro (pets tank when more than 1 arrive)
Pal, Dru, Sha, War, Enc, SK
Pal, Dru, Enc, War, Enc, Mag -- LOL, was my first 65 HARD win group
Pal, Dru, Monk, Rog, Dru, Rng (this was a little difficult until we had the 2nd druid kite Adds.)
LOL - as you can see, we're tried with a TON of different combinations in the past, and almost all of them work. People just have to know how to play their class in LDoN, pay attention, and be ready to react.
I've always been a mildly-intense puller, and pulls of 3-4 mobs at once isn't the most uncommon. LOL - it's why some people say I'm more a Trainer than a Puller... For things to work for us, people need to stay alert and on their toes.
I've got to admit though -- almost ALL the groups I tend to find are VERY capable players. Maybe it's where most of them are lv 65 and have learned their class by then, but I really can't think of too many horror stories that I'd be able to share from LDoN.
From what I've seen, I'd be willing to try ANY group combo really in a LDoN. Maybe it's not the "standard" Tank-Healer-Mezzer-Slower-DPS-DPS Type, but that just tends to add to the challenge and make things more interesting.
After all, what's the worst that can happen? A death, and small wait for the corpse to pop, and then simply looting back up. The adventure alone in an odd group makes up for anything else.
I agree that the groups that I lead or pick and choose the members have always had the most success. Any one's that I've gotten picked for we have always had issues.. LOL.
Quote:Pal, Dru, Enc, War, Enc, Mag -- LOL, was my first 65 HARD win group
That was fun.
Quote:I've got to admit though -- almost ALL the groups I tend to find are VERY capable players.
If anything I get groups with 5 good people and 1 idiot that begs the question, "How'd he/she get past PC?"
to be honest Heiro and i dont mean this to be rude or anything. but most the times dont try to understand why people do what they do. its ok to let it annoy you, upset you, or what i prefer make you laugh at them till you cry 
. its best to just say hummm ok and move on .
Did a group with 2 shaman, a pally and myself once. And we finished with a fair amount of time to spair. I don't know how the heck that worked. but it did. LOL
The only groups that are really in danger to not finish on time are caster dependent, paci pulling groups. Its one thing for the pally to pull using paci. But, when a chanter has to paci thena warrior goes and pulls....well, its a slow group. Even if its "fast" dps wise.
I'll tell ya this one thing---any group with a GOOD bard, and I don't care how bad most of the players are, is a good group. I've seen bards work miracles. And, really, I don't know if anyone can pull LDoN better if they know what they're doing. I don't know what they're doing, but they sure as heck can pull!! lol
Now that I'm 58, I really don't know what would be my choice. I think I could heal a LDoN fine now, whereas before, it would be a huge challenge, require a chanter AND a shammy, which slows the group down having 2 non dps classes and no cleric. lol. But, I have ch thank Tunare!
Before, I liked having a shammy, pally, BL, rogue, cleric and myself. cycle in a bard for the bl or the rogue, works either way. There are just so many combinations that work for normal dungeons. But, lately, I find that LDoN exp really isn't that great. Maybe its because the range has been big on the last few, or maybe its bad exp for high 50s, or maybe I've been spoiled by PoV, but that's just something I realized. Over the course of a LDoN, I have been getting like 2 blue bubs, which in the time it takes to get that maybe not terrible (though not great), but it takes at least 45 minutes to get a group going---even if you find one right away. Group leaders are generally very picky, though I don't think they should be. As long as there's a good healer, a person who can pull, a person who can keep aggro and take a few whacks, and some decent DPS, it doesn't really matter.
I completely agree with you Heir, waiting around for LDoNs is a waste. But, to me, LDoNs in general are a waste lol. Unless you have the people on that you know to get a group going and then go do it. To me, I'd rather try to get into a PoV group, or a good PoD/PoN group (i love doing the hobgobs in pon or the big bugs near the castle thingy in PoD). Its not that I don't like LDoNs, its just that its not what I'm going to do for exp generally speaking. I do LDoNs for fun, for a little cash on the side, to save up the points I'll need for my high level LDoN spells, for fun with guildies, and maybe a potential aug drop or something (the last one I did there were 4 or 5 aug drops lol, the lucky melee---yes, there was only 1 melee there---got like 2 or 3 of them by default haha), but that's about it.
Did I mention my other character is a lvl 59 bard...hehe, bards rock, I have to take breaks from playing him because as busy as I am when I pull as a pally it is nothing compared to what is needed as a bard. Twisting four songs is what I do, I dont do one or two. When you group with Elamarx you can expect AoE chorus of replenishment(HP/mana regen 12 per tick), Verses of victory 35% haste plus str, Katta sword dancing +40 dex plus dex reducing proc, and either a group resist song or damage sheild depending on the circumstances, I can mez up to lvl 57 mobs, I can charm, if I go full offensive I can stack 3 dots that do 71 hp per tick each or 213hp per tick damage. Iane, I really do not get "mad" and I do not really waste my time trying to figure folks out, to me it is there loss, just that it does affect me and I feel they are flawed in their logic, and I am somewhat sure some folks in Keepers have the same oppionions, not many but perhaps some. I am willing to listen to the "otherside" of the arguement to see how being picky and wasting time LFG is better than knocking out 2 or 3 lower adventures in the same amount of time, but I agree with what most folks have said. If you know how to play your character more than likely you will win. The times I have failed two have been Link death related, all three assasinates I have tried failed, one by like 3 seconds(we killed the mob 4 secs after we got the failure message), and 2 due to wipes right at the end where folks ran out of mana or a very bad pull was made. The loot and xp is all I need the AP's are a nice bonus....See ya all Thursday.
Another thing is, to many players don't know what other classes, with players who know how to play thier classes, can bring to a group. When playing my necromancer, I've supprised several groups with the capabilities of the class. Suetekh has been mezer, slower (in BB), backup healer (auspice to keep the cleric from wasting mana on people other then the tank.), nuker, doter and when all else fail mana battery (I'm a last resort twitcher usually though because I'm usually using mana on my other spells). Of course there are still folks who think all im there is to twich, like a paladin the other day who asked for a twitch when i was the mezer and slower of the group and we just went though a string of undead.
